I can understand vegetarians but not vegans, especially for eggs. They are a good source of protein, and in safe amounts are really good for your cholesterol. Chickens naturally lay eggs almost everyday and no animals are harmed in the collection or production, if you buy free range. It's pretty much their menstruation; it just happens; the unfertilized eggs are not alive.

Milk is a little more iffy since cows don't naturally produce milk longer than is needed by the calf, but continuous milking stimulates the cow to produce milk, it doesn't actually hurt it.

Can someone please explain to me why fish aren't classed with meats when defining vegetarians? They have brains, eyes, digestive tracts, nerves, muscles, sexual organs, locomotive appendages, etc.

ILuvEire, you could become a pescatarian and eat fish but not other meats. But I think that's mostly a health, not ethic life choice.

Actually, they are. Somebody who eats fish but not meat isn't a vegetarian, they're a pescetarian.

Why don't you tell the chickens confined to a cage too small for them to turn around and forced to live in their feces that they're not being harmed? Free range poultry in the USA, according to the USDA, are only animals that are allowed access to the outside. It doesn't say how much time, nor define the quality of the land. Free range is nothing but a cop out.

Also, there's something incredibly unappetizing about chicken period. Just sayin'.


No, selective breeding and hormones make the cow continue to produce milk. Although dairy cows have better conditions than other animals, they certainly don't have good lives. Their bodies are so destroyed, literally milked to death, that their life expectancy falls from 15 or so to just 5 years. Well, rather, their bodies are so spent that after five years of life (milking begins at two - each cow is only worth three years of milking up to thrice a day) they are no longer profitable, so they are slaughtered.


It's just cultural bias. To most cultures, dead animals are made up of fish, [red] meat, pork and poultry. Most of the people that eat fish also eat poultry, they just abstain from red meat. These people usually do it for a religious reason, not an ethical one.

Anyway, ethically, I cannot eat any kind of animal, even if I really miss seafood. Plus, I started eating kosher, so I don't get oysters anymore either.

Also, I'd like to add that honey is the only animal product that I continue to use. We get it from my grandma's friend who harvests it from the bees herself. I feel like it's a symbiotic relationship, the bees are provided a safe place for their hives, in return they give up some of their honey. Most commercial beehives kill many or most of the bees during harvesting or actually kill the whole hive after harvesting if they don't intend to keep them over the winter. Then, next season, the queens are artificially insiminated by ripping off the head of a worker, which causes arousal, then basically squishing the dead worker to force ejaculation. Additionally, I'm not quite sure what my stance is on the status of bees as animals. Obviously they are living things, and therefore very important to their ecosystems, but I don't really know if they feel pain, or if they can be "tortured," like fish, birds and mammals.

Why? You're not Jewish, are you?

You could get eggs from the farmer's market.

A vegan eating oysters? lol

Why'd you go Kosher? Presumably a gentile and as a vegan , I'm pretty sure the only law that would apply to you is making sure that your vegetables don't have insects.

I guess you're right though. Good luck in your vegan endeavors. Be sure to keep yourself from getting a B12 deficiency.

There are others, like the laws on wine being made in Israel. But his task would be a lot easier.

I didn't mention it since he's only 16 and his family is presumably not Jewish, i.e. no Seder with four glasses of wine or grape juice.

Well, I went kosher before I went vegan. We are jewish, we're just bad jews I'm technically considered a convert I think, because it's my father's family that's jewish, but my mom is on board as well.

You haven't formally converted, have you? Because that's pretty tricky.

Don't forget, if his mom converted before he was born, he won't have to.