Poyn tij!

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Poyn tij!

Postby Huixuan » Mon 19 Apr 2010 12:55 am

Hello, I'm Robert Xun, thirteen years old, and I have been using Omniglot for maybe two years now to learn pronunciations of lots of different languages. However, I'm mostly only a monoglot or trilingual, depending on what you consider "speaking a langauge."

English: Native; I use it for almost everything.
Spanish: I grew up with Spanish so it comes naturally. However, if I don't have time to check myself with a dictionary, I might accidentally say stuff in Spanglish (make up Spanish words out of English words). The Spanish I use is Peruvian Coast, so if you hear me refer to avocadoes as "paltas" or socks as "medias," then you will know why.
Chinese: Not quite as great in Chinese, but I can get by, written and spoken. I can write simplified and traditional but my simplified is better. The dialect I use is Mandarin, but I am not too good with literary Chinese. Wǒ kàndedǒng pīnyīn. I also read Bopomofo but I don't really have a practical input system.
Gurcaj: It's my conlang, but it's constantly undergoing rennovation so I won't say too much about it until it is done. The title says "good day" in Gurcaj.

Opinions:
1) Traditional Chinese is more elegant, but simplified is better in the long run for China.
2) Esperanto was a good idea at the time, but it has lost its universiality because it uses only European roots, even for words like Beijing (Pekino).
3) Hanyu Pinyin is by far the best transliteration system for Mandarin, but it doesn't have a Chinese flavor.
4) Quechua is a beautiful language.

Interests:
1) Grammar; it is maybe my favorite part of languages
2) Stress; I am obsessed with stress, but I mean linguistic stress
3) Sesquipedalia; I like it. Can you not see that when I say it, it is true?
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Re: Poyn tij!

Postby Smart » Thu 29 Apr 2010 2:44 am

Huixuan wrote:Hello, I'm Robert Xun, thirteen years old, and I have been using Omniglot for maybe two years now to learn pronunciations of lots of different languages. However, I'm mostly only a monoglot or trilingual, depending on what you consider "speaking a langauge."

English: Native; I use it for almost everything.
Spanish: I grew up with Spanish so it comes naturally. However, if I don't have time to check myself with a dictionary, I might accidentally say stuff in Spanglish (make up Spanish words out of English words). The Spanish I use is Peruvian Coast, so if you hear me refer to avocadoes as "paltas" or socks as "medias," then you will know why.
Chinese: Not quite as great in Chinese, but I can get by, written and spoken. I can write simplified and traditional but my simplified is better. The dialect I use is Mandarin, but I am not too good with literary Chinese. Wǒ kàndedǒng pīnyīn. I also read Bopomofo but I don't really have a practical input system.
Gurcaj: It's my conlang, but it's constantly undergoing rennovation so I won't say too much about it until it is done. The title says "good day" in Gurcaj.

Opinions:
1) Traditional Chinese is more elegant, but simplified is better in the long run for China.
2) Esperanto was a good idea at the time, but it has lost its universiality because it uses only European roots, even for words like Beijing (Pekino).
3) Hanyu Pinyin is by far the best transliteration system for Mandarin, but it doesn't have a Chinese flavor.
4) Quechua is a beautiful language.

Interests:
1) Grammar; it is maybe my favorite part of languages
2) Stress; I am obsessed with stress, but I mean linguistic stress
3) Sesquipedalia; I like it. Can you not see that when I say it, it is true?

Welcome to the forum! enjoy
Native: English (Mother Tongue), Spanish (second)
Advanced Fluency: French, Latin
Beginner-Intermediate: German, Esperanto
Will learn: Portuguese, Dutch, Afrikaans, Italian, Catalan.
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Re: Poyn tij!

Postby desmond » Wed 05 May 2010 6:37 am

Do you mean bopomofo gives a Chinese flavour?
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Re: Poyn tij!

Postby Huixuan » Wed 05 May 2010 10:42 pm

Eh? I just can't really type it that well, at least not plainly.

Yes it does give Chinese flavour. But sadly it can't really be used practically except in teaching.

www.ㄅㄟˇㄐㄧㄥ.com would be a little hard to access by Europeans
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Re: Poyn tij!

Postby Neqitan » Sun 16 May 2010 5:38 am

Hehe, you Asian-Peruvians. :P
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Re: Poyn tij!

Postby Talib » Mon 31 May 2010 3:04 am

Traditional Chinese is more elegant, but simplified is better in the long run for China.
I wouldn't go that far. Both Hong Kong and Taiwan have higher literacy rates than the PRC, which would seem to suggest it's the quality of education that matters more than the writing system used.
Esperanto was a good idea at the time, but it has lost its universiality because it uses only European roots, even for words like Beijing (Pekino).
I wouldn't say it was ever universal because it was designed with Europeans in mind. But Peking is just an older transcription of Beijing based on its pronunciation at the time.
Yes it does give Chinese flavour. But sadly it can't really be used practically except in teaching.
What about as ruby characters, like hiragana are in Japanese?
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Re: Poyn tij!

Postby Huixuan » Thu 03 Jun 2010 11:56 pm

I wouldn't go that far. Both Hong Kong and Taiwan have higher literacy rates than the PRC, which would seem to suggest it's the quality of education that matters more than the writing system used.

I find simplified a little bit easier to learn new characters. It takes a while to learn how to write ji3 (how many) in Traditional compared to simplified.
I wouldn't say it was ever universal because it was designed with Europeans in mind. But Peking is just an older transcription of Beijing based on its pronunciation at the time.

I happen to know that Mr. Zamenhof took "Pekino" from "Pekin," which is Beijing in his native Polish, the best source of vocabulary for Chinese words (hint of sarcasm). And if you don't believe me look at "Kantono" meaning "Guangzhou." That's not even close, because Canton came from Gwong-zau corrupted into Portuguese Cantao (with nasal on second a) which turned into English Canton and eventually got to Poland that way. Imo that's a cheap evasion of what should be Guangzao (with breve on u) in Esperanto.
What about as ruby characters, like hiragana are in Japanese?

Well, that works, but when I IM friends on a computer like the one I'm using now which lacks basic symbols, I'm all like yo, ni hao ma. ni zai gan shen me? I don't really type Zhuyin in that case.
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Re: Poyn tij!

Postby linguoboy » Fri 04 Jun 2010 5:29 am

Huixuan wrote:That's not even close, because Canton came from Gwong-zau corrupted into Portuguese Cantao (with nasal on second a) which turned into English Canton and eventually got to Poland that way.

Nope. Portuguese Cantão was a transcription of Guǎngdōng. When the Portuguese arrived in the city, the name "Guǎngzhōu" did not yet exist.
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Re: Poyn tij!

Postby Talib » Fri 04 Jun 2010 5:44 am

I find simplified a little bit easier to learn new characters. It takes a while to learn how to write ji3 (how many) in Traditional compared to simplified.
Yes, it's a little more complicated, but once you learn how, you're not going to forget it. Some traditional characters are more distinct from each other.
I happen to know that Mr. Zamenhof took "Pekino" from "Pekin," which is Beijing in his native Polish, the best source of vocabulary for Chinese words (hint of sarcasm).
Which is from Peking, the European transcription of how Beijing was actually pronounced at the time. There's a good chance it would have ended up as something like "Pekino" anyway. Not that it really matters since Esperanto is a conlang spoken by at most two million people. English has Beijing.
Well, that works, but when I IM friends on a computer like the one I'm using now which lacks basic symbols, I'm all like yo, ni hao ma. ni zai gan shen me? I don't really type Zhuyin in that case.
Why not use an input editor that converts pinyin to characters?
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Re: Poyn tij!

Postby Huixuan » Fri 04 Jun 2010 6:12 am

Yes, it's a little more complicated, but once you learn how, you're not going to forget it. Some traditional characters are more distinct from each other.

Lol yes I do forget.
Which is from Peking, the European transcription of how Beijing was actually pronounced at the time. There's a good chance it would have ended up as something like "Pekino" anyway. Not that it really matters since Esperanto is a conlang spoken by at most two million people. English has Beijing.
It should be bejkingo by that pronunciation. And they should have changed it a while ago to bejghingo. It follows all the other rules of romanization in Esperanto with actual cities. Why should Chinese people learn extra words just for Europeans' sake. Just curious, you speak Chinese right?
Why not use an input editor that converts pinyin to characters?

Because it's easier to type pinyin, and most of my friends are more proficient in pinyin than characters. It's so much more complex to typpe in Chinese and I haven't figured out how to type Chinese on this computer. I can on my computer but not this one.
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