Teaching yourself Russian

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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby Sobekhotep » Tue 07 Jul 2009 2:02 am

Neqitan wrote:
Sobekhotep wrote:
dtp883 wrote:my teacher said that many Spanish speakers can't trill their /r/'s.

That makes me feel better because I absolutely suck at [r]! :(
Although I've never heard any Spanish speakers on TV that couldn't pronounce it.
I read that a lot of Boricuas pronounce /r/ as [x] but I've never heard anyone pronounce it like that; it's always [r]. :|

[x]? That's crazy! :lol:

So my name would be /xe.'na.to/! OMG

:D
That's similar to how many Brazilians pronounce it: [xẽ.'na.tʊ]

dtp883 wrote:I think the reason you've never heard someone pronounce /r/ as /x/ is probably the same reason American English speaking actors will never* lisp /s/ > /θ/ nor talk with a non-GA accent unless they are in a role that requires it. They want the actors to seem universal and adhere to the official language.

That makes sense for tv & film. But I've met numerous Puerto Ricans throughout my life and yet I've never heard it. But I've heard all the other Puerto Ricanisms...
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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby Neqitan » Tue 07 Jul 2009 2:37 am

Dtp883, don't tell me about Caribbean dialects, they have too many non-standard features for me to care about how they pronounce /r/. Whenever I hear a young Puerto Rican speaking is just... scary, laughable, silly, and amusing!
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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby Sobekhotep » Thu 09 Jul 2009 4:55 am

Neqitan wrote:Dtp883, don't tell me about Caribbean dialects, they have too many non-standard features for me to care about how they pronounce /r/. Whenever I hear a young Puerto Rican speaking is just... scary, laughable, silly, and amusing!

The Caribbean vernaculars are my favorites! :D
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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby Neqitan » Fri 10 Jul 2009 2:55 am

I mean, seriously, one day I was watching a talk show and they had invited a semi-popular Reggaeton singer from Puerto Rico. The song went well and was understandable, but at the moment he started being interviewed I just :shock: . When I visited Cuba, I couldn't he locals help noticing the locals there pronounced their vowels with a bunch of nasalization, along with a very special intonation....
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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby Sobekhotep » Fri 10 Jul 2009 3:39 am

Neqitan wrote:I mean, seriously, one day I was watching a talk show and they had invited a semi-popular Reggaeton singer from Puerto Rico. The song went well and was understandable, but at the moment he started being interviewed I just :shock:

:lol:
Do you remember his name?
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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby Neqitan » Fri 10 Jul 2009 5:47 am

Young Puerto Rican reggaeton singers are like Japan's idols. :lol: They raise and fall quickly, like fast fads, so I really don't know.
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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby Kloiten » Thu 13 Aug 2009 9:16 pm

Neqitan wrote:
dtp883 wrote:You didn't mention it but /ɹ/ for /ɾ/ and /r/ really bothers me, even though my teacher said that many Spanish speakers can't trill their /r/'s. I'm pretty sure they don't use /ɹ/ as a substitute.

They do use [ɹ]. My brother is one of them. Apparently, he has a particular ligament length under his tongue that doesn't allow him to trill his /r/, but he refuses to undergo the small operation. :roll: I've always mocked him for being a native Spanish speaker and yet he doesn't pronounce /r/ as he should. :D


Aw, man, you're mean. :( I've always felt ashamed for never being able to pronounce my /r/'s because I'm a native Russian speaker. I always hesitate to say words that start with /r/ because they make my accent ever so noticeable. I often resort to using /ɹ/ as a surrogate /r/, but... it doesn't sound right. :cry:

Do you think that /l/ for /r/ is a good replacement? :D

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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby Sobekhotep » Fri 14 Aug 2009 1:28 am

Kloiten wrote::( I've always felt ashamed for never being able to pronounce my /r/'s because I'm a native Russian speaker. I always hesitate to say words that start with /r/ because they make my accent ever so noticeable. I often resort to using /ɹ/ as a surrogate /r/, but... it doesn't sound right. :cry:

Do you think that /l/ for /r/ is a good replacement? :D

Can you produce a tap or flap? That would be [ɾ]. If not, maybe try an uvular approximant or trill. I read somewhere that Vladimir Lenin spoke Russian with an uvular rhotic. :) Is that true?
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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby mike92s8 » Thu 27 Aug 2009 1:22 am

The /r/ is the biggest problem with Spanish that I'm having right now. I never have been able to produce it, and I've never found someone who could tell me quite how. Then I found this website which has helped me at least be able to produce it after d's & t's (sorry I still need to nail down the IPA).

http://books.google.com/books?id=yyqU_t ... q=&f=false

pg. 25, for the trill. I'm still working on it and if anyone else has any suggestions I would really like to hear them, because I still struggle. Also it is a pretty interesting read.
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Re: Teaching yourself Russian

Postby dtp883 » Thu 27 Aug 2009 7:01 am

I couldn't trill my r's for the longest time. But then I learned how to with an online tutorial and saying butter quickly and other things I forget but now I can do it. It actually spills over into my English in some rapid speech.
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