Talk in a language you don't know

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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby Tikolm » Sat 01 Sep 2012 9:34 pm

vegandiste wrote:Hi there, I don't speak German, so here goes:

"Vom Himmel hoch da komm die Engel hier."

Translation: From heaven high comes the angel here.

Hi Tikolm :D You've got lots of cool ideas. Ciao!

Diolch yn fawr, vegandiste! ([Thank you very much, vegandiste] -- that's Welsh. I suppose I should use German, but whatever, I don't speak it either. :P)

If anyone's still interested in correcting me, I'd like to know if Mae ci a chath yn mynd is a valid sentence or if I got it wrong. I'd also like to know if a(c) always triggers the spirant mutation or if there are exceptions, but maybe this is the wrong place to ask that.
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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby Tikolm » Sat 01 Sep 2012 10:35 pm

linguoboy wrote:I know Tikolm gets annoyed if I only correct and don't participate myself, so to show good faith here's an attempt to render the same sentence in Breton:

Eus an neñv uhel deu ar ael amañ.

I can't think of anything in particular to say to this. I think I recognize a few of the words, though (correct me if I'm wrong -- deu = dod, ar = yr, amañ = yma). Just out of curiosity, which of the Celtic languages can you put together sentences in?
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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby linguoboy » Sun 02 Sep 2012 6:15 pm

Tikolm wrote:If anyone's still interested in correcting me, I'd like to know if Mae ci a chath yn mynd is a valid sentence or if I got it wrong. I'd also like to know if a(c) always triggers the spirant mutation or if there are exceptions, but maybe this is the wrong place to ask that.

It's register-dependent. The spirant mutation is uncommon in spontaneous colloquial speech nowadays; many Welsh-speakers would say ci a cath. What you have isn't wrong, it just comes across as more formal.

Tikolm wrote:I can't think of anything in particular to say to this. I think I recognize a few of the words, though (correct me if I'm wrong -- deu = dod, ar = yr, amañ = yma).

No, those are all correct. Deu actually corresponds to daw, which in spoken Welsh is the inflected future tense of dod. Neñv uhel in Welsh is nef uchel and "angel" is angel (pronounced complete different from English despite the spelling).

Tikolm wrote:Just out of curiosity, which of the Celtic languages can you put together sentences in?

All of 'em, given enough time and trouble.
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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby Tikolm » Mon 03 Sep 2012 7:39 pm

linguoboy wrote:It's register-dependent. The spirant mutation is uncommon in spontaneous colloquial speech nowadays; many Welsh-speakers would say ci a cath. What you have isn't wrong, it just comes across as more formal.

I see. I'll just leave that bit out then -- less to worry about. I was going by something it said in the lullaby book (clyd a chynnes, I think) which may be slightly out of date.
No, those are all correct. Deu actually corresponds to daw, which in spoken Welsh is the inflected future tense of dod.

I figured I wouldn't be picking the right tense inflection. I don't know most of those things.
All of 'em, given enough time and trouble.

Good to know.
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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby vegandiste » Mon 03 Sep 2012 9:57 pm

Diolch yn fawr, vegandiste! ([Thank you very much, vegandiste] -- that's Welsh.


You're welcome Tikolm :D So I guess I won't be saying

O Omniglot, ich muss dich lassen. Hehe! in English. Hmm... another language...used to know a bit of Italian:

C'é la luna, mia amica cara.

Merci pour le "fil" Tikolm. J'aime beaucoup la langue du Pays de Galles.
À bientôt.
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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby Tikolm » Mon 03 Sep 2012 11:03 pm

vegandiste wrote:Merci pour le "fil" Tikolm.

De rien ! :)
J'aime beaucoup la langue du Pays de Galles.

Ah bon ? C'est bien ! Tu veux dire «gallois», n'est-ce pas ? («Gallois», ça veut dire «Welsh» en anglais.)
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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby Tikolm » Wed 05 Sep 2012 12:54 pm

I can't really write much here -- have to go to school -- but I think you'd like to know that I've been writing Welsh notes in my school binders instead of giving my teachers my total attention. :roll: I'm also trying to learn how to roll r's, but I haven't gotten past the stage where I can be heard doing it from a few rooms away and it sounds like hissing. I'd like to learn how to roll r's well before I learn to speak Welsh, because I don't want to go around sounding wrong.
Bye now! :)
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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby Tikolm » Thu 06 Sep 2012 11:05 pm

linguoboy wrote:"Wyt ti'n pwyso yn erbyn y ddôr?"
"Nag ydw, dw i ddim yn pwyso yn erbyn y ddôr! Paid â fy nwrdio fi!"
"Dydw i ddim yn dwrdio!"

I just looked up the unknown words in the suggested dictionary, and here's a really crummy translation:
"Are you leaning by the time of the door?"
"No, I'm not leaning by the time of the door! Don't with my scold me!"
"I'm not scolding!"

I can't understand what the first two lines might really mean. University of Wales said that pwyso is something along the lines of "press/lean", erbyn is "by (the time of)" and paid is "don't". I think â is "with" or something like that, but maybe it isn't (got that information from a somewhat mistake-riddled "word-for-word translation" found on this page). It looks as if you mean "leaning on the door" and "don't scold me", but I'm having a hard time figuring out why it would be done in such a roundabout way. Can you tell me what's going on here, linguoboy, or are you too busy?
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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby Tikolm » Thu 06 Sep 2012 11:56 pm

linguoboy wrote:Yn gywir, cant y cant!

"The [no matches], hundred the hundred!" I'll have to run this through GT and see how it does:
Sincerely, one hundred percent!

That makes a little more sense. Is that what you intended? If so, what is it sincerely a hundred percent of? Were you referring to the dog sleeping under the car?

Chysgiff y gath ddim ar wely nad mae e ddim yn gynnes!
(I love [sarcastic] how every single word has a red underline except for y and e.)
You said this was correct, but elsewhere (I'll reference the post if you like) you said that ydy had to follow nad. I'd like to know which statement was right.
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Re: Talk in a language you don't know

Postby linguoboy » Fri 07 Sep 2012 3:21 am

Tikolm wrote:I can't understand what the first two lines might really mean. University of Wales said that pwyso is something along the lines of "press/lean", erbyn is "by (the time of)" and paid is "don't". I think â is "with" or something like that, but maybe it isn't (got that information from a somewhat mistake-riddled "word-for-word translation" found on this page). It looks as if you mean "leaning on the door" and "don't scold me", but I'm having a hard time figuring out why it would be done in such a roundabout way. Can you tell me what's going on here, linguoboy, or are you too busy?

The preposition isn't erbyn, it's yn erbyn. Searching the complete phrase gives you the correct translation, "against".

Note that the default for searching the UWTSD dictionary is "Term entered is: The whole word." This will only find exact matches. It won't find phrases containing the particular word. For that you need to change the selection to: "Term entered is: Part of a word or phrase." If you search for an exact match on the word paid, you will only find the translation "don't". However, if you search for phrases containing paid, you will get examples such as:

paid â bod yn ddig wrthyn nhw don't be angry with them cmb.
paid â brysio take your time cmb.
paid â busnesa! mind your own business cmb.
paid â chrio, cariad don't cry, dear cmb.
paid â chynhyrfu! don't get excited! cmb.
etc.

What this shows you is that the â is part of the negative imperative construction when a verb-noun follows. (If it helps, think of paid â as meaning "cease with", so paid â brysio is "cease with hurrying", paid â fy nwrdio fi! is "cease with my scolding", and so forth.)
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