Atükan

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Re: Atükan

Postby linguoboy » Thu 10 Jun 2010 3:25 pm

XshadowX wrote:lol. But there are some that could be objects like You.

"You" was originally an object form. The subject form was "ye". But over time, "you" came to be used in both places. You can't expect other languages to have gone through the same quirky developments as English.

Compare German: Ihr seht uns "You [plural] see us" vs. Wir sehen euch "We see you [plural]".
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Re: Atükan

Postby XshadowX » Thu 10 Jun 2010 3:39 pm

ok. Wel I will leave it like that then. Make thing a lot easier. I think my next lesson will be on numbers.
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Re: Atükan

Postby Remd » Thu 10 Jun 2010 3:56 pm

lol. But there are some that could be objects like You.


Yep...but if you are following the pattern of English pronouns (and I think you are), you'll need another form for "I" as object, because there's "me" in English (as well as "him" and "her"). On the other hand, as Linguoboy said, it doesn't have to be like English at all o_O.
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Re: Atükan

Postby XshadowX » Thu 10 Jun 2010 4:01 pm

Okay. Well I will leave the pronouns how they are. But I am still missing pronouns. Him and her. and I think that is it.
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Re: Atükan

Postby linguoboy » Thu 10 Jun 2010 4:27 pm

XshadowX wrote:Okay. Well I will leave the pronouns how they are. But I am still missing pronouns. Him and her. and I think that is it.

These aren't necessarily "missing". Plenty of languages do without third-person pronouns entirely and use demonstrative pronouns (i.e. "that", "those") instead. Even among languages with distinctive third-person pronouns, those with both "he" and "she" are probably in the minority.

The more you learn about other languages, the less likely you are to simply recreate your native language in exotic guise.
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Re: Atükan

Postby XshadowX » Thu 10 Jun 2010 5:05 pm

ok.
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Re: Atükan

Postby kaenif » Fri 11 Jun 2010 3:33 am

Just to make things more confusing (lol),
some (in fact a big number of) languages do not mark objects at all, like Chinese

我 打 你
I hit you

你 打 我
You hit me

You can notice that the "I" takes the same form no matter in subject or object.
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Re: Atükan

Postby XshadowX » Fri 11 Jun 2010 3:52 am

Don't you mean you? And I will just leave it like how the prnouns are now. I will add third person because it doesn't feel right not have third person nouns.
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Re: Atükan

Postby Kloiten » Fri 11 Jun 2010 4:48 am

linguoboy wrote:
XshadowX wrote:A : IF this is in pronunciation the a is pronounced like it is in van or cat.

Like [veən] or [kʰeət̚]? Well, that's simple enough!


I guess that's why I asked xShadowx for his/her dialect... I assume it's a SAE [æ], but you never know, eh?

xShadowx: Take a look at [veən] and [kʰeət̚]. Those are pronounced something on the lines of (assuming the é is pronounced like in Standard French) vé-uhn and ké-uhn. That's probably not what you say (I, for one, have never heard that before. I think it's something eastern). That's the beauty of IPA: it's easy, practical, and gets over dialectic diaspora.
I was asking you about your dialect because it's crucial in understanding how your language sounds like. Not everyone speaks English the same. For all we know on the net, you could be Scottish. And that would screw things up for those that are Americans here. You can at tell us the region in which you live. For example, if you were to tell us that you live here, we would know that you more or less speak a very neutral type of American English. Even then we can't be sure, because everywhere there's always a person who has an accent of some sort. I, in my Pacific substituting-t-as-a-coda-with-a-glottal-stop vowel-heightening Northwest, have found people as young as kindergartners who speak with a fluent "British" accent despite never having been anywhere near the Islands their whole life.
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Re: Atükan

Postby kaenif » Fri 11 Jun 2010 11:56 am

XshadowX wrote:Don't you mean you? And I will just leave it like how the prnouns are now. I will add third person because it doesn't feel right not have third person nouns.

I think I'll need a table to explain this. I think this is not very confusing.

For English,
Code: Select all
As subj - As obj
I       - Me
We      - Us
You     - You
He      - Him
She     - Her
It      - It
They    - Them

You can notice that some pronouns are the same as subject or object, and some are not. 'He' and 'Him' are basically the same thing but changed in different positions in the sentence.

In the contrary, for Chinese,
Code: Select all
As subject   - As object
Wo (I)       - Wo (me)
Women (we)   - Women (us)
Ni (you)     - Ni (you)
Nimen (y'all)- Nimen (y'all)
and etc.

The pronouns do not change no matter subject or object. This is different.

Basically, you can put anything on the table, pronouns being different or same being subject or object.

In Esperanto,
Code: Select all
As subject - As object
Mi (I)     - Min (me)
Vi (you)   - Vin (you)
Li (he)    - Lin (him)
and etc.


It is important to not just copy English. A conlang needs to have something more different.

Thank you. :)
Can you recognise this character?
Nope, it's not shāng. It is a 囧 with a hat which 囧ed its chin off!
囧囧囧囧囧囧囧囧囧!
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