The Nazis weren't rational people.

Comparing the situation of animals to the Holocaust is insulting in the extreme, however. I say this as a vegetarian.

They thought they were rational. Just like you think you are. Rationalism is one of the weakest philosophies.

I don't see comparing the treatment of animals to Holocaust as insulting. In fact, I don't see how that is insulting at all. But that might stem from the fact I don't understand the concept of insult.

If you aren't basing your arguments on rationalism, what methodology are you using? But regardless the Nazis relied on all sorts of pseudoscience, mysticism and emotional appeals. They were the opposite of rational in many ways.
Insulting to people who actually endured it, because it's not a valid comparison. At the very least it's a totally different order of magnitude. The purpose of agribusiness isn't to cause undue suffering to animals and exterminate entire species.

You state it's not valid. It's perfectly valid. Just Jews are not bread over and over so that they can be killed over and over again.


Who cares what is the cause. That would be like saying: I wanted to try out my new shotgun on my friend, I had no intention of killing him.

I don't feel like discussing this subject anymore. From my point of view you are not able to grasp higher ethics and keep rationalizing everything from a position of a homo economicus. I'd feel more comfortable talking to a philosopher about this subject.

Huh?
I'm afraid we can't all be philosophers, but if you feel you have stronger ethical arguments feel free to present them.

I genuinely don't feel like doing that. I'll leave you to think about why all living creatures deserve to be treated with respect, dignity, kindness and affection and how without giving them this we humans will never become ethical.

If you want to postulate an argument, then dodge the question when you're called to support it, you might as well have not brought it up in the first place.
I'm fairly certain most people, not being psychopaths, would agree this is a goal to strive for - and it's bound to be a lot more productive than scare tactics like comparing chicken coops to Auschwitz.

I just wanted to talk to someone. If I find out the discussion is not going the way I wanted it, I mean the debate has become more of a nuisance then enjoyment, I'd want to leave because it is not the experience I wanted to have on this forum, I'm not dodging the question. Have you ever thought I'm not able to answer it properly and feel ashame of my poor knowledge and expression skills and would rather talk to someone with whom I can have better communication? Most of my discussions fail because I'm not able to establish a proper line of thought with my opponents. I think it has do with a fact that I'm a visual type and place much emphasis on gestures and tone of voice rather than words, meaning I'm more comfortable and better at talking to people than posting with them. But even talking to people can be hard for me because I'm quite shy and speak slowly and I lack wit. Basically, I can honestly say that most of my time I dislike communicating with other people completely.

Gah, it's great to have time to browse the Omniglot forum again ^^

For some reason though, I can't seem to vote in the poll. In any case, I'm a borderline vegan. I'm only 16, so I still live with my family. I do my best not to make the rest of them conform to my lifestyle, as I'm not a dick head and respect that, although I think they're being stubborn and purposefully ignorant, they disagree with me. We just try not to talk about it and get along

I don't eat any sort of meat, fish, gelatin, or eggs, and I try my best to eat as little dairy products as possible. I'm not quite able to give it up totally yet, but when I'm out buying my own groceries, then I'll give up dairy as well. I didn't have a problem giving up any of this, except for sea food. I don't think about it, because I miss it terribly

But, it's worth it. My first reason not to eat meat is that, I feel, at this point in time, that we don't have to eat meat to get protein. Well, really, there's no feel, I know I don't need meat, I just like it. Pleasing my taste buds, though, is that worth a life? No, I don't think so. If I had to eat meat, naturally I would, but I don't *have* to, so why cause the unnecessary pain? I do my best not to support the dairy industry because of the torture and exploitation that the animals are put through. I can't put money towards that. Once again, why cause all that unnecessary pain?

The other big reason for me is religious, so I don't use it in debates, just because, if you don't share my religious views, then it's irrelevant to you. But anyway, my belief is that everything contains a spark of God. By harming other living things, I'm harming a spark of God. Of course, I can't live without harming anything, I know that, but I do my best to do the least amount of harm to anyone or anything going down my own path.